Kevin Thompson [00:00:00]:
Hey. Welcome back to Change the Odds, where marriage and family were never meant to be a game of chance. My name is Kevin Thompson. Last week we talked about kind of part one of this series on these two important words to attend and attune. So if you haven't listened to that yet, go back to that one where we define what it means to attend. We define what it means to attune, listen to that, apply it for a week or so, kind of get a feel of what it actually feels like, and then come back and listen to this episode. And today we're going to look at some of the neuroscience of what's going on, how this actually impacts our sex life and intimacy, and then give you some practical things that you can apply to make sure that you're doing better at attending and attuning. So let's begin kind of looking at some of the neuroscience of what's going on and some of the experts that I lean on whenever it comes to this.
Kevin Thompson [00:00:47]:
So Sue Johnson says that this emotional security, which is what attending and attuning do, they provide an emotional security, that this connection, the attuning to each other's softer feelings and longings is the core of love. It's what Siegel talks about that we need to be seen and soothed and safe and secure. Whenever we attend and attune to our kids, to each other, we get that sense of being seen, of soothed, of safe, and now what a secure love actually is. But notice this, that over time, couples who stop paying attention and tuning in drift into what Johnson calls an emotional isolation. They begin to live these parallel lives. So here's the downside. When you and I do not attend and attune to each other, we will begin to live parallel lives that are emotionally adrift from each other. And there's multiple dangers of that.
Kevin Thompson [00:01:48]:
For one, there's if I leave my spouse emotionally isolated, it really does set her up for somebody else to come in and to emotionally validate her in an inappropriate way. And then she's in danger, and so am I. But then beyond that, if I leave her emotionally adrift, I'm more likely to be emotionally adrift. I'm going to start writing negative interpretations of what's going on because I'm not truly secure understanding what's going on inside her heart or who she actually is is. And so we got to think about this idea of what even attending and attuning does is it's an empathy and a validation that actually begins to calm our nervous system. So I don't Know if you've ever read the study or not, but they did a study with dental hygienists and dentists as well, that when the dentist didn't say, hey, this is going to hurt, they then injected the shot without warning. Or they downplayed and said, oh, this won't be a big deal at all. And then it actually was.
Kevin Thompson [00:02:47]:
Then the patient's heart rate was elevated. But when the doctor came in and said, hey, this is going to hurt, and here's how long it's going to hurt, and, man, I know this isn't what you want, but you're going to be able to endure it. When the dentist emotionally validated the patient, their heart rates began to go down even as they were experiencing negative consequences. So when you and I are emotionally validated, it calms us, because what's going on, whenever we feel unseen, unheard, all those kinds of things, we feel isolated. And the great threat to humanity throughout human history has been that of isolation. You've heard me say before, the only defense mechanism that we have as human beings are relationships. And so whenever we are isolated from our tribe, we are now in danger. It's why solitary confinement is the worst punishment you can possibly experience.
Kevin Thompson [00:03:40]:
And you and I are so hardwired within that mindset. And so whenever we feel seen, whenever we feel brought in to the experience of somebody else, it has a calming effect over us, even if the negative consequences are still going on at the same time, Even if there aren't many negative consequences going on around us, but we feel emotionally isolated, it's going to raise our stress levels, our cortisol, it's going to raise our heart rate, our blood pressure. All those negative consequences are actually going to come from it. And so we want to be empathetic. We want to validate other people because it has that calming effect. Dan Siegel says it this way. He talks about name it to tame it, that as we name emotions, those emotions actually become more tame over us. Whereas if we leave things unnamed, unseen, they begin to control us in many way.
Kevin Thompson [00:04:32]:
So Siegel also reminds us about this human concept of resonance. He talks about how we have these mirror neurons, which now allows us to understand the experience of somebody else and to take on, in an empathetic way what they're actually experiencing. And so he says, you can't resonate with a partner if you're perpetually distanced. Instead, being physically present is required now. Now, obviously, there are times which you're traveling. You can't be in a phone call, a text message, all those are important. But if you're never physically present, there's a great danger that's there because these mirror neurons literally need a physical presence now to begin to pick up what our spouse is actually experiencing. One thing Gottman says is it is impossible to nurture health relational dynamics without practicing attunement.
Kevin Thompson [00:05:25]:
This is now a necessary step in every relationship. It's a skill that we really have to begin to learn. And so much of it is what Gottman talks about, this non defensiveness. So one of the great threats, there's multiple. One of the great threats to not being attuned to another person or attending to them is we get defensive. And when you and I are defensive about ourselves, we are no longer focused in on our spouse, no longer recognizing what they're feeling, instead solely kind of focused on what's going on for us. And whenever that happens, you can feel like there's a break in the relationship. So think about it this way.
Kevin Thompson [00:06:03]:
You want to focus on understanding your spouse more than defending yourself. So before anytime you feel tempted to begin to justify what it is that you did, pause, take a deep breath and say, this, help me understand more. And what that does is it gives you time and space to calm down, and it gives your spouse the opportunity to speak more. And here's what tends to happen as you speak more, you're not being defensive. As they speak more, they actually probably begin to calm. Whereas if you get defensive, as we said last time, they'll want to double down on what it is that's actually taking place. So think about this. In short, to attend and attune first, understanding must precede our advice or solutions.
Kevin Thompson [00:06:50]:
We talked about that in the previous episode, that we're going to put emotional support before we try to get to solutions. So let's look at how this plays out in our own intimate lives, and then we'll get to some practical realities of what this looks like in our lives, because this does have an emotional impact on our intimacy and what we feel like. Sue Johnson, her great love Hold Me Tight Love Sense is also a book that she has. She talks about securely bonded lovers, that literally it is the key to better sex, that good sex is not just a physical expression, it's an emotional experience. And so she says that to the extent that we trust our partners emotionally, we have far more freedom and exploration and enjoyment of the sexual experience. Matter of fact, Sue Johnson says the best aphrodisia, maybe emotional connection, when a spouse truly gets you outside the bedroom, it frees you to Be fully yourself inside the bedroom. So as important as anything else might be to turn your spouse on, an emotional connection is probably the most impactful thing that you can do to impact your intimate experience. Johnson talks about it as synchrony, that we're trying to get in sync.
Kevin Thompson [00:08:14]:
Almost like two dancers now are moving in a common rhythm and one is playing off the other. That is what we're trying to get to in an emotional aspect with our spouse, where there's a synchronous kind of concept in what's taking place. And she says whenever that happens, oxytocin begins to be released, the bonding hormone takes place. And she says a synchrony of sex happens with emotional openness, responsiveness and physical pleasure. So we are emotionally open, we're exposing ourselves emotionally, we're treating our spouse properly as they expose themselves emotionally. We are now responsive to what we're seeing. We're dancing with one another. And then whenever you put physical pleasure in the midst of all of that, there's a potential with intimacy that we can't experience outside of that emotional connection.
Kevin Thompson [00:09:09]:
So when both partners feel safe to say, I like this, I need to slow down, speed up without any fear of judgment, physical intimacy becomes a true extension of the emotional connection. And this is something often forgotten about whenever it comes to sex, that at its best, it's this physical extension of an emotional connection that produces this tremendous experience. As opposed to people just thinking it's just a physical outcome. Physical outcome can be good, I'm not denying that. But it's far better to have this emotional connection, which is why I think sex was designed ultimately for marriage, where that can begin to take place. So one thing Johnson and Gottman and others begin to promote is to make sure that you're adding intimacy to these everyday moments. And that can be an aspect of attending and attuning. Whether it's Gottman's six second kiss, his 60 second hug, a gentle touch on the shoulder, holding hands whenever you're at an event, holding hands, maybe in the car, sitting close to each other whenever you're on the couch, as you go to sleep at night, to have some kind of touch that is actually present.
Kevin Thompson [00:10:19]:
If you can add the sprinkle in this physical intimacy, this non sexual touch, it will have a great impact on your relationship. But whenever you begin to stop paying attention to those things, then there's a tremendous amount of danger. All right, let's look at some practical ways that we can attend and attune and then we'll close out this episode. Number one, we have four here. Number one is regular check ins. Just again, as I'm going to say in the creation of us next year, what is the rhythm by which we are connected? And to the extent that we can create these healthy rhythms, we will always know this space is here. We are far more likely to attend to our spouse, to be attuned to our spouse if there are these regular things that we know what's going to happen. And notice this, whenever you have these regular check ins, here's what you gotta be careful about.
Kevin Thompson [00:11:10]:
Especially the younger your kids are, the busier life is, is you have to have a moment where you can talk about who's running to the dentist appointment, what's the kid's homework, what's the sports schedule next week, all those are important. But at what point do you ask the question, hey, how are you? No, no, really, how are you? How do you feel today? Is there anything that you're concerned about? Where's your stress level of what's going on? Attending and attuning is much more to attune. It's much more about those deeper questions than just who's running the kid here or there. Now notice this. It's almost like Maslow's hierarchy of needs, right? For a family, you have to take care of who's paying the bills, who's cooking dinner, who's picking up the kids from school, who's running them here, who's running there. Those things have to be taken care of. And once you take care of those, then you can come up to a higher level and begin to ask the deeper questions. How are you? How do you feel? Are we connected or not? But when you and I just jump to those questions and don't deal with the day to day kind of needs, it's probably not going to work.
Kevin Thompson [00:12:13]:
It's kind of like in a church setting where people want to talk about somebody's salvation. When the person is hungry, you need to meet the hunger need first and then we can talk about the deeper spiritual needs that are actually there. Basically a regular check in where you're asking those types of questions begins to scream very loudly an important message. Your inner life matters to me. Take a look right now. Based on how you interact with your spouse, not based on how you feel, based on what you actually do, is that communicating to them that their inner life matters? If the answer is I don't know, that speaks volume. And it's fair to begin to say the way your spouse acts towards you, do you feel like your inner Life matters to them. If the answer is no, that's worth a conversation.
Kevin Thompson [00:13:02]:
How can we begin to change that? Maybe you send this episode to them and say, hey, listen to this, let's talk about this tonight on the front porch. So regular check ins would be, number one, practical aspects of how to cultivate attending and attuning that, number two, eliminate distractions. So if this is about being seen, what does that mean? That means our spouse needs our full attention. So it can't be a concept of I'm sitting here texting and talking at the same time. Now there are times that that happens, no question. But if that is always the nature of it, if there's never a time and a day in which my spouse has my full attention. I talked about in the last episode. One of the patterns that Jenny I've gotten into just in the last couple days is sitting on our deck and watching the sky because there's a meteor shower, right? We made the joke.
Kevin Thompson [00:13:49]:
If I start watching birds, we know I'm near the. But we're watching the sky and what happens? The power of that is there's no television, there's no game on, there's no laptop open to a book that's being written or an ad that's being bought by Jenny and there's no phone. The absence of technology now empowers that. Let me encourage you to think about it in this way. What is one habit or routine that you and your spouse could incorporate that you're not used to right now that would give this space to attune to each other, to ask these questions? What is one thing, one place that you're going to put technology off limits so that you can really focus in on each other. I think the average couple could so benefit not only from a walk, could benefit from just sitting out on the porch, sitting out on the deck in the wintertime for me and Jenny, it's going down to the hot tub and I don't take my phone to the hot tub. There's no technology. It's just the two of us.
Kevin Thompson [00:14:43]:
In that moment we can get to the really deep questions of life. What would it look like if you begin to intentionally carve out a 20 minute, a 30 minute segment of your day to say, hey, whenever we get up in the morning before the kids wake up, we're going to go have coffee out on the deck or after we put the kids to bed, we're not going to come in and turn on the television, we're not going to go to our separate spaces we're going to sit in this other room that we don't normally sit in, and we're just going to connect with each other. We're going to talk what it would look like to go on the back porch. We're just going to kind of hold each other in this moment and just be there. That kind of space is necessary, but we have to eliminate the distractions. And I get there are seasons of life that are so busy, it's very difficult. But here's what I can't help but think is true. Obviously, the situations I deal with are life changing for people.
Kevin Thompson [00:15:31]:
On many occasions, if I can put my phone away for dinner, if I can put my phone away for time to spend with Jenny and really not feel a consequence, because people know I'm going to get back to them, even though they're dealing with life and death scenarios, chances are you can too. Rare would be the occurrence in which a listener is out there at this moment that they would say, I literally cannot go 30 minutes without my phone. If that's you. Chances are far greater that you're an addict than that you're really that busy or that important. So make the time. Eliminate distractions. Number three, practice empathetic listening. Empathetic listening.
Kevin Thompson [00:16:10]:
We probably need to do a whole show about this maybe whenever Blaine and Adrian begin to get back. But empathetic listening now is, I'm drawing out of you. I'm validating your experience and drawing out of you to speak more. Counselors do this all the time. If you've ever been to counseling, you probably have experienced the other side of this, in which maybe a counselor would say, hey, sit with that a little bit longer. Tell me more. What they're doing is now you've taken it to a line. They now want you to go deeper, and they're giving you space to do that very thing.
Kevin Thompson [00:16:43]:
And then as you're talking, they're not saying, oh, you didn't really feel that. Oh, it's not really that way. They will actually make more statements than questions. And they might say, that must be really hard. That has to be heartbreaking. And now you're empathetically listening in a way that's validating the person's experience. Think about little phrases like, it sounds like you felt left out when I spent the evening working, so you felt left out when I was doing this. You're validating what they're saying to you.
Kevin Thompson [00:17:17]:
I hear that you're really worried about this. So now, in your own words, you're mirroring what was said to you and giving them the chance maybe to correct you, to say, no, that's not what I said, that's not what I meant. But it's important that we don't rush to give solutions, don't rush to give advice. We don't in any way minimize their feelings. Julie Manano says it this way, I'm with you in this, not trying to fix you out of it. I'm with you, not trying to fix you. That's what empathetic listening begins to say. One of the questions we can't ask.
Kevin Thompson [00:17:52]:
Jenny and I worked on this early on. We're kind of reversed in our relationship. Many times she'll try to fix me and I'll be like, I just want you to listen to me. And so now whenever I have kind of telling her about a situation in my life, she'll ask me the question, hey, do you need me to just listen to this or do you want me to fix it? And there might be times when I'm like, oh, you can fix it, fix it. But most of the time it's not, no, I don't need you to fix it. I'll take care of this myself. I just need you to listen. But that just clarifies what it is that I need from her in the moment.
Kevin Thompson [00:18:20]:
It's a very caring kind of way to go about it. And then don't forget, as we talked about last time, Gottman's attune system of being aware, turning toward tolerance, understanding, non defensiveness and then that engaged kind of way. That is a way that we can now validate somebody else's experience and notice this, I think this is important. You do not have to understand your spouse to believe your spouse. Understanding and belief are two different things. Jenny. At times she and I will be talking about something and we have two radically different experiences about something. And in those moments, I may not understand what she's saying, but I believe her in it.
Kevin Thompson [00:19:05]:
Think about the concept of intimacy, right? So she can't understand how intimacy drives me. I can't fully understand how it doesn't drive her, but I can believe her that she still loves me, is attracted to me, desires me, even if it's not at the top of her mind as it is the top of mind. She doesn't understand how often it can be at the top of my mind, but she can believe me that this is my experience, that it's important that I'm not wrong or evil, perverted for thinking about intimacy more than she actually does. You don't have to understand your spouse in order to believe them. Those are two different things. And we have to recognize what that actually means. So whenever you and I can be emotionally available for each other, it just provides the safety that is there. But notice an aspect that's so important for how this works.
Kevin Thompson [00:20:01]:
One of the byproducts, the positive byproducts of attending and attuning to our spouse. But then also one of the ironically prerequisites to doing this is that we have to learn to repair rupture quickly. If we don't learn how, ruptures are always going to occur. That's just an aspect of life. There's always going to be a feeling of a disconnect. A misunderstanding is going to happen. We're going to act in the wrong way. Time itself is just going to disconnect us.
Kevin Thompson [00:20:27]:
If we don't learn the skill how to repair that quickly, then the byproduct is we're going to lose the space where we really can't attend to our spouse and and to attune to them. However, if we develop the habit of attending and attuning, it actually empowers us to repair far faster. So a question I've asked you before that I want to ask you again Is the typical fight between you and your spouse, how long does it last? Is it a week? A couple days? A day? And the more that we can shorten the span of repair, the better off we're going to be. I know. I mean, generally speaking, Jenny and I are never going to have a disconnection that lasts longer than a day. Rare would be the case for it to last longer than a day. Well, think about that. If our pattern was a week, we would lose so much time and there would be such a feeling of disconnection.
Kevin Thompson [00:21:20]:
Whereas now we've shortened it to such an extent that even if we feel it now, I know we'll be better by tomorrow. I can almost guarantee you that. And that idea of repairing rupture is such an important skill that if you struggle with it, I would highly encourage you to seek professional help because this is one of the areas, not the only area, but this is one of the areas in which you can get an almost immediate return on investment. As a counselor can listen, can navigate your pattern, see what's going on, and then begin to assist you of how to make that repair even better. So these two words, attend and attune, I just can't tell you how important they are. They're so important. I want you to have those words visible to you every single day and then begin to get to work on what that actually looks like. And if you have questions about it, we would love to answer that.
Kevin Thompson [00:22:10]:
You can text marriage to 56316, ask your question and in coming episodes, Blaine, Adrian and I will begin to answer them in YouTube. You can comment, just leave a comment there in the comment section and we'll begin to get to your questions. But we simply know the truth is very clear that if you and I can attend and attune, it can make a radical difference in our lives. Listen to what Sue Johnson says. We'll close with this. Love is a constant process of tuning in, connecting, missing, misreading cues, disconnecting, repairing and then finding deeper connection. And as we go through that process, by prioritizing, attending and attuning, we truly can change the odds in marriage, creating not just a lasting relationship, but one that thrives with intimacy, trust and joy. We'll see you next time.